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Caryl Matrisciana
Guest speaker on Point Of View with Marlin Maddoux
Topic: Gods of the New Age
8-8-02
Marlin:
Caryl Matrisciana good to have you back.
Caryl:
Thank you Marlin. Thank you so much. It is good to be with you again,
Penna too.
Marlin:
You know Caryl, one thing I want to talk with you about before we get
into some of the other subjects. We played some of the sound track and
talked about the Ganges River, but those scenes of the teaming thousands
of people gathered at the Ganges River washing and so on, did you guys
actually film that yourselves?
Caryl:
Pat and I filmed everything that you see in Gods of the New Age. Oh,
the stories behind the scenes, the outs that went out onto the floor,
were almost more amazing than what we put into the film. That film footage
is just incredible, isn't it? Just the teaming millions and millions
and millions of Indians that come to the Khumbha Mela, which is a religious
festival that happens once every fourteen years when certain planets
and stars and all the astrological energies are fixed in the right places.
These people come together for a vortex of energy, a kind of spiritual
zap, and walk hundreds of thousands of miles, millions of people. There
are hundreds of thousands of priests and godmen and enlightened men
and camps. I don't know how many acres, but people are camping together
for a month. The actual nature festival, if you will, takes about ten
days, which is the high, sort of climax of the festival. There is all
the leading up to it for ten days, then leading down after. There are
human stampedes, in fact, seven years before we filmed, where they have
a sort of half, the min Khumbha Mela, Stanley Kubrick brought a host
of filmmakers and one or two of his crew got stampeded to death. There
are deaths.
Marlin:
Why do they come?
Caryl:
Well basically to dip into the river Ganges, which is considered Mother
Goddess. The map of India is Mother Goddess herself. The river is scene
on one level as the giver of life because she supplies water. On the
other level, she is the supplier of life spiritually. So, the concept
from physical and spiritual is entwined in Hindu religious thinking.
In fact, the Hindu religion is so complex that you really can't define
it, because it is cultures, it's folklore, it's superstition, it is
a spiritual concept of life itself, so the environment is holy. The
cow is holy, because the cow is the supplier of milk, which of course
is the energy of food. The cow also comes back as a reincarnation of
somebody, of an enlightened man. I remember as a child, going to school,
walking along the sidewalk, and amazed always because I saw this one
particular cow tethered to the sidewalk. The cow had a limb growing
out of its neck, which was a little hoofed leg. So it was actually a
distortion, and the cow had garlands of flowers around its neck and
was adored like a god. People would come, and as I was going to school
I remember thinking, I would see these poor Indian people giving a bowl
of rice, or a little mixture of milk and sugar to the cow, and all around
it were these bowls of food. They would put garlands around her neck
and this was a god. Of course money was given to the owner. So, any
perversion in a state is edified as god consciousness. Just like the
time that I remember that I was attacked by an insane person. I was
just a young thing and it was a terrifying experience. This man that
had matted hair with cow dung in his hair, broken bad teeth, stunk terribly,
naked. Thousands are walking along the sidewalks in the city of Calcutta
where I was born and raised, and this man just came up and grunted like
an animal and jumped over me with incredible strength and started attacking
me, much like an animal would attack another animal in heat. I was terrified,
and it took my companions to kick this person to bring some kind of
reaction, much like when you kick an animal to get him away. I remember
people came up to me afterwards and touched me. I was terrified. I was
a little girl terrified and they touched me, trying to touch my holiness,
because I had been just touched by a holy man, yet he……
Marlin:
Oh my word.
Caryl:
…..he was insane.
Marlin:
But he was considered a holy man?
Caryl:
Tantamount, because insanity is considered tantamount to holiness.
Marlin:
Alright, okay, explain to me then how the roots of that belief system
comes from the streets of India like that, and finds its way into a
class for AT&T, Ford Motor Company, and the schools, and the churches,
and it is accepted as a way for improvement.
Caryl:
Well Marlin, I think the thing to do is that one has got to understand
the spiritual warfare that is going on in the hidden world that we don't
see. The unseen world. We are told that we don't wrestle against flesh
and blood, but against powers and principalities. There is a real war
going on. Now, Satan is not a creator, he is a counterfeiter of what
has already been created. This type of faith that we are seeing going
into AT&T and IBM and corporate America and into the medicine world
and all this in classes in stress management teaching is part of the
idea of the Biblical concept of faith, where we give up thinking in
a human sense and rest on a belief system unseen. But, our system, the
Biblical concept is that God is a person and one has belief, although
one doesn't see Him, but God himself came down to be seen, and we have
an example in Christ. In Hinduism it is giving up your mind to be insane,
which is quite different to walking in faith, but it seems very close,
it is a counterfeit.
Marlin:
But you are not going to convince a teacher fresh out of college or
maybe a few years longer than that, which is leading her little class
to empty their minds and meditate and relax to get them settled down.
Caryl:
Right, but there you go.
Marlin:
What is the leap from their to the schoolroom scene?
Caryl:
Emptying your mind, emptying your mind, and it being done in a sort
of movement of giving up your thinking, whereas remember the first commandment
tells us that we have to love the Lord our God with all our mind. So
within Biblical thinking we are not to give up our mind. Within occult
thinking you have to give up your mind in order for spirit beings to
come into it, to be able to use your body to give you a higher, what
they call, human potential which is within you.
Marlin:
Caryl Matrisciana with us ladies and gentleman. You need to listen to
the program today, take it very seriously. I want to recommend that
you get a copy of Gods of the New Age. It is a very, very powerful movie,
103 minutes in full color. Let me read you a little bit on the back
here, it says, "With explosive facts it explains why 60 million
Americans have been led to Eastern mysticism's embrace that smothers,
exchanging the certain hope of salvation for the hopeless cycle of reincarnation.
The Gods of the New Age reveals why thousands of churchgoers have begun
to believe the lies first told by the serpent in the Garden of Eden.
Why yoga, meditation, psychological therapy, and self-help are turning
millions to a pagan world view, and how the West is being intentionally
evangelized by Eastern mystics and New Age visionaries." Some of
you are involved in some New Age activities, you may not even be aware
of it. Maybe you have taken a yoga class, but it's just for the exercise.
We are going to be asking Caryl Matrisciana about that, you will want
to find out what she has got to say. To get a copy of the video through
Point of View you can order it by calling 1-800-347-5151. 1-800-347-5151.
We do suggest a minimum gift of $24.95. Ask for the video Gods of the
New Age. The phone number again 1-800-347-5151. Stay with us we'll be
right back.
Marlin:
Welcome back ladies and gentleman. Caryl Matrisciana with us and we're
talking about the New Age. I want to go back to a cut in the video The
Gods of the New Age. This is just one of those videos that you have
to have in your home, you have to view it, show it to your children,
show it to your friends, and it will help to get a handle on what is
going on in some of the churches and the schools all across America,
in businesses, in society, in the movies, in television. This nation
is absolutely saturated with New Age thought. I am going to play this
cut, then we are going to come back and talk to Caryl. I think there
is something in here about yoga. Let's hear what we've got.
(Playing film)
Penna:
Caryl Matrisciana is with us, she is the voice that you hear on that
video. This disturbs me so much Caryl, because I see in our society
right now, people taking this very lightly. I mean, they are talking
here about a serpent that they see at the base of the spine in the human
body. It is really Satan doing these exercises and this yoga to unleash
those powers. Yet, you have Y.M.C.A.s all over the country, health clubs,
power yoga classes, even Christian doctors recommending yoga to get
rid of stress and to build strength. I mean which is it? Can you have
one without the other, or is yoga just innately a spiritual discipline?
Caryl:
Well within Hinduism yoga is considered a prayer. It is a prayer of
yoking one's self with that universal life that is believed to be everywhere,
that we are one with the life. So actually you have got to come inside
of yourself, focus inside, and get in tune with your enlightened person,
your god spot, your human potential, what is in you, within humanism.
They say that it is the power that you have within. For instance, in
the entertainment world it is the Star Wars force, the force be with
you, it is the internal force that you can have. So the entertainment
industry is pushing this force which is in you. Now that is contradictory
to what Jeremiah 17 says, that there is no good thing within us, we
are deceptively wicked. So to look within ourselves for what is good,
it is futile. We have to look outside of time and space to the God that
created the universe, that is where we get our strength. So this is
a counterfeit of the power within you, the breath within you. As Johanna
Michaelsen mentioned in that film, that Prana yoga is the breath inside
of you that gives you power. Well you go back to Genesis where God breathed
his Holy Spirit into us for life. Now, what yoga is trying to do is
to tell us to go back to that place of voidness before God breathed,
to in a sense become dead.
Marlin:
You mean all of this is in the exercises?
Caryl:
Yes, because you are told to give up your mind. In yoga you are told
to relax, think of nothing, blank your mind. That is in complete contradiction
to what the first commandment says, which is to think about the Lord
your God with all your mind. So what this is doing, in a sense, is putting
you into neutral. The moment that we become, are put into neutral, we
open up doorways for the occult. Now an interesting thing is that this
is being taught in schools, it is not only in all the things that you
mention, Penna, with medicine and stress management and corporate themes
of being able to work harder and bring in better business. But what
I find so frightening is the fact that this is being taught in schools
through, for instance, our little Harry Potter, which has become required
reading to young, young children. The symbol, the motto of Harry Potter's
school, the Latin translation of that is, "Never wake a sleeping
dragon or serpent." So here we have this occult school of Harry
Potter's, a thousand-year-old school where all the students are taught
to awake that power within them, their inner potential, to concentrate,
which is now being changed from this particular film The Gods of the
New Age. What we did was we went back to the roots of where Eastern
mysticism comes from, but it is so integrated into our society today,
that our young children are being taught it in different ways, to harness
that potential within you, and that we can do all things, and our kids
can do all things. This is part of the indoctrination of the global
child.
Penna:
So, you have a well-meaning teacher who thinks she is going to harness
the potential inside the student and probably relax them, teaching them
basically these Hindu or Eastern techniques that, in some cases, could
actually cause them great harm.
Caryl:
In some cases they do, as we showed in that film. By the way, I recommend
people to buy this film from Marlin. It is such an incredible offer,
because I have had so many letters from people who say that they gave
that film to a friend of theirs that was in the New Age, or was a Wiccan,
or somebody that was dabbling with the occult, and their lives got changed.
The letters I get just saying thank you for clarifying it and letting
us see the roots of Eastern mysticism and what's happening. This is
a transformation, this is changing a whole generation from Judeo-Christian
traditional values to Eastern mystical values. Just the concept of yoga
was designed within Orthodox Hinduism, the oldest generation after they
had given birth, after they had raised families, after they had been
involved in business. The grandfather would go into an Ashram, or a
community, to learn from the god man how to die to themselves through
yoga. To die to themselves, to die to their emotions, to die to their
feelings, in preparation for reincarnation. Now this very same technique
used to prepare the elderly for reincarnation, to get on to their next
life cycle, is now being taught to the young.
Marlin:
That is incredible. Let me take a break. When we get back we'll take
phone calls. If you have a question for Caryl here is the number 1-800-351-1212.
Stay with us, your phone calls straight ahead.
Marlin:
We're back. Caryl Matrisciana with us. The phone number 1-800-351-1212.
Give us a ring. Caryl, you know, I have talked about secular humanism,
I've talked about the changes in the schools, moral relativism, and
all of this. Is all of this part of the continuum, the New Age movement
and all of that?
Caryl:
Marlin, you are always wonderful the way that you know that these things
are all part of the conditioning process of transformation. It's in
a transformation. It's changing us to take on the whole new world religion,
which is tolerant to all religions as equal. Not tolerant to all religions,
as your entitled to your opinion and I am entitled to mine, tolerant
as equal. Multiculturalism says that they are all the same, so therefore
you have the Pope getting together an Assisi of all the world's leaders,
hundreds of world leaders, and they are all praying supposedly to the
same god. The Pope is endorsing that kind of ecumenical religious worship,
saying also to go to India and look at the way India is viewing mankind,
how they view man, we should be learning from that. Well, I grew up
in India and man is not considered a value and worth when you give a
cow food and milk and drink it's urine as part of your spiritual cycle
upwards in your evolutionary process. Yet people are starving. You don't
have a high view or moral obligation. In fact, in our film The Gods
of the New Age that you are offering, which I highly recommend people
to purchase, a very well-known Indian author in there mentions that
when he was in college in India they went on a social program to help
Indians, to help them in the villages, to help feed them and look after
them, and their professor came up to them and said, "what are you
doing? You don't go out helping Indians, because what they are suffering
right now is due to their Karma." Or what they brought into this
life from what they have done in past lives. Now this is what we are
teaching our Western world today.
Marlin:
We're saying that we should go then and learn from these people?
Caryl:
We should learn from these people. That we are going to not die, for
instance in the Harry Potter book which I brought up before, and I know
you have offered the Harry Potter video, that there, in book #1, the
principal of Harry Potter's thousand-year-old occult school says, "Harry,
death is the next adventure." Well, that is being taught in Goals
2000 in schools across America, that death is an adventure, death education,
that suicide is okay and acceptable because reincarnation is a valid
option. Which is completely contradictory to the Bible which says that
we are worth something to God and our lives are worth something, and
abundant living is worth something. So, children today are faced with
the problem of why should I live? What is it worth? What is the point?
Suicide is higher now than it has ever been.
Penna:
Caryl, isn't it true that in Hinduism and the New Age there is no such
thing as the concept of sin? So, in a sense, you do see that influencing
our society. Maybe it is not out there so people are looking at that
and saying that's weird, now that it is in so many of these institutions
and in the schools. Is that part of the reason now that all of a sudden
we can't even call right, right and wrong, wrong?
Caryl:
Exactly, exactly. That is part of the conditioning in transforming.
If we are without sin, if all sin, if there is no such thing as evil,
no such thing as sin, if we don't have moral absolutes, that is why
the schools are teaching values clarification. If there are no things
as morals and ethics, then why do we need a savior? Because we are without
sin. The wages of sin is death, therefore there is no death, there is
just reincarnation, and it all goes hand in hand. So what you do, your
morals, don't push your moral standard onto us. In fact, part of school
education is to teach the children to separate from the traditional
values of their parents, particularly if they are rooted in Biblical
concepts.
Marlin:
Let's take some phone calls. 1-800-351-1212. Liz in Missouri. Hi Liz.
Liz:
Hi. I am really in Kansas, but that's alright.
Marlin:
Sure.
Liz:
I don't have a question. I think the lady expresses herself very well.
The thing is, I think that she just too easily translates the Bible
maybe not correctly, and I think that you can't dismiss Hinduism as
evil. It is an ancient religion. You can't……
Penna:
Would you call it Biblical?
Liz:
You can't call it Biblical, no, but Biblical can't be everything. I
mean, a human being can't understand everything about every religion.
You can't say the Pope is wrong for having ecumenism, you know. I just
think that you can't dismiss Hinduism, and you can't translate the Bible
for everyone as you are doing.
Caryl:
Liz, I think, I understand what you're saying, and certainly the way
that you are talking is an interesting kind of tolerance towards the
equality of all religious belief. That is part of a process today where
we are being told that all religions are equal. Hinduism is an ancient
religion, but remember so is Biblical, so is the Bible. God began it,
exactly, in fact a little earlier than Hinduism. Hinduism came out of
man's rebellion. There are two world views, there is the Biblical world
view that came from the God that created the world, then there is another
world view which is man interpreting God's heart or mind.
Liz:
I see. Well, you say morals and ethics. You seem to be saying that Hinduism
has not got that, and Muslims do not have ethics and morals.
Caryl:
Actually Liz, I didn't say that. I just said that it was a different
morality and a different ethics. I think that is a misunderstanding,
because there are morals and ethics, they are just not necessarily Biblical
morals and ethics.
Liz:
And you are saying that they are not equal to our Judeo-Christian beliefs?
Caryl:
What religious background are you from?
Liz:
I'm Roman Catholic.
Caryl:
Oh, yes I was born and raised in the Roman Catholic Church too Liz.
Liz:
So was my mother who is now a Methodist.
Marlin:
I think what we are getting down to here is, and this is not a put down
Liz, but I have talked about these things for years. We are talking
about the whole concept of tolerance, the idea that all religions, all
values, all moral systems are equal. Sometimes it goes so far as to
say that the only bad people in the world are those people who are the
narrow-minded, etcetera, etcetera, who insist that they are right on
certain issue. It boils down, very simplified in my mind, I'm a simple
guy. You have two concepts of God, you have a God who is a being, a
person, in the Judeo-Christian viewpoint, who is beyond us, He is outside
of us, so He is the one that created the earth and so on and so forth.
The other concept of Hinduism is that there is this great force and,
you know, if we do it right we can all become gods. You can argue one
side or the other, you have to accept one or the other. I don't think
you can mingle these two and be part this way and part the other way
Caryl.
Caryl:
Well, the Eastern pagan occultic mystical concept, which is the alternative
to God's thought, is the concept that man can be his own guide. Man
can make up the rules that he wants. It is a sort of buffet, potpourri
of eclectic thought. So you can take a little bit of food from here
and a little bit of spiritual food from there, etcetera, etcetera.
Marlin:
I am going to have to take a quick break. Liz, thank you for calling,
call back again sometime.
Liz:
Thank you.
Marlin:
Okay bye. Got to take a quick break. Caryl Matrisciana. If I had Liz's
address I would send her a copy of this video free, as a friend. You
need to see it, but the issues that we are talking about today are real.
Get a copy of it. It is yours for a suggested gift of $24.95. To order
it you can call 1-800-347-5151. 1-800-347-5151. Ask for the video Gods
of the New Age. You can also write to me, the announcer will give you
the address. Love to hear from you. We'll be back after this.
Marlin:
Welcome back ladies and gentleman. Penna Dexter with me. Our guest in
the studio is Caryl Matrisciana. Jeremiah films over the years has produced
some of the best documentaries on a variety of subjects. I have talked
to her and her husband Pat over the years and I am just grateful for
their work. We are talking today about a video they produced called
The Gods of the New Age. It is one of those that I highly recommend,
it is must viewing. Caryl Matrisciana is a fifth generation English
family, born in England, English colonial, born in India, fifth generation
English colonials. With her own background in drugs and Eastern mysticism
she has the credentials to investigate the roots, the progress, the
future of the New Age phenomenon and what it's doing today. So, when
you are talking about these issues, Caryl is probably one of the most
knowledgeable people on these issues. I don't know Penna, I guess it
is just the difference between men and women, even controversial callers;
it's that nice English way of sidestepping and being kind. I am learning
from you ladies, not much, but I am.
Penna:
Well you know she does have a very nice, sweet, soft way of doing things,
but she cuts right to the heart of the issue in everything she talks
about, and especially with the New Age. There are very few out there
who understand the roots, the history, and then what it is doing to
our society, to Christians, and how it is influencing even the church.
Caryl and Pat Matrisciana have influenced and changed hearts and minds
for decades. I think the area of the New Age and this kind of spirituality
is one where people in the church even have been deceived.
Marlin:
One of the things that we talked about a little bit in the last hour,
and I want to caution, warn, enlighten, encourage, especially the young
people less than 40 years old, 30 years old and particularly younger,
that have been brought up on values clarification, been brought up on
non-judgementalism, having adopted even in their Christianity, a value
system of moral relativism The surveys show that even evangelical Christians
do not believe in moral absolutes. A large percentage of us, especially
the young, that we can't say the Ten Commandments are absolutely right,
that Jesus Christ is absolutely the Savior of the world, because that
is judgmental and so on. So, in their moral relativistic view they are
unable to say something is right and something is wrong. Nowadays, I
have talked about this for 25 years I guess, but in the last few years
I'm not challenged on the authenticity of what I have been saying, I
am challenged on my right to even say it.
Penna:
Right.
Marlin:
I think that is a very dangerous thing.
Penna:
Well you know we got that from our last caller, Liz. Really it saddens
my heart to hear something like that. To hear someone who says I am
raised in the Catholic Church, and yet I don't have the ability to say
that my religion is better than Hinduism, or that my beliefs are right
and those beliefs are wrong. That kind of attitude has permeated the
church and the society, and that is where we are, and that is why we
have to get the truth out.
Marlin:
Indeed.
Caryl:
Well, I would go one step further than that, Pena, and say that if we
listen to say my opinion versus your opinion versus Marlin's, then we
are all on the same ground. I think what we have got to do is say what
is God's opinion, and you see that can't be challenged, unless you say
that the Bible isn't a relative book. That is what is being taught today,
that the Bible isn't relative, the Bible isn't truth.
Marlin:
So you take society, you take the church, the movie industry, whatever,
and you reach into society and you convince them that you can't be judgmental,
you have taken away the Christian's ability to say that Jesus is the
savior of the world and you need to be saved, when the person says well
that is your view and you don't have a right to impose it.
Caryl:
Exactly. What you have done is you have taken away God, who says that
God is truth, because Jesus says "I am the way, the truth, and
the life." So if Jesus is truth, that is our standard. Now the
world is saying, no, Jesus isn't truth. So we are saying God isn't truth.
So, it is not my opinion versus another human being's opinion. It is
actually human beings questioning and challenging God.
Marlin:
Let's take some calls. 1800-351-1212. Jennifer is in Dallas, Texas.
Hello Jennifer.
Jennifer:
Hi, I am calling today because I appreciate the relevancy of your show.
I was just looking for a way to witness to my friend who is very involved
in the New Age Movement through the Unity Church and studying Reiki
and some other things. I am trying to witness to her and sometimes my
basic is to go back to who Christ is, because either He is who He said
He was or He isn't. He said He was God and they hated Him for it then,
and today we still take persecution for that. I won't back down on that
stand. I wondered if you had any other resources, aside from the video,
that I could pick up to minister the life of Christ to these people
who I know?
Caryl:
Jennifer I would ask you to consider getting this video from Marlin,
because actually what it is, is probably about 20 years of research,
incredible visuals going to India and all sorts of other places in Europe,
England, Norway, Denmark, all sorts of places. Actually interviewing
men who say that they are higher than God. In fact, one of the Hindus
said, "The guru is greater than God." Here you have got all
the man-made opinions coming into a 103 minute video which so concisely
and so incredibly explains everything that you would be saying. I think
the point is that pictures are better than words sometimes. A thousand
visual images today work so much better than argumentation or dialogue.
This is a really, really incredible film to give to your friend. I have
heard so many come back with reports of how this film changed their
lives. I would encourage you to hang in on the truth. You are coming
from the concept of Christ is the truth, but this is a thinking that
is becoming more and more minimized. If we can say that Christ is just
another guru or another good man or another good teacher, and the Bible
is just another Koran or Bhagavad Gita, then that is the way of discrediting
our Christian witness. But, this film is good, it takes you around the
world and I think it is a great tool.
Marlin:
Thanks Jennifer.
Jennifer:
Thank you.
Marlin:
You know if the early Christians had just gone along with that bit back
during the Roman Empire, and said that Jesus is God, but so is Caesar,
they would have been thrown to the lions. But they kept saying, "Jesus
is Lord."
Caryl:
And that was a group of people that dared to stand against the culture,
because the culture at that time was very, very similar to our culture
today, that embraces all religions as one. In fact, in Acts 17 when
Paul walked along Mars Hill he saw all the gods being offered there,
and even to the Unknown God, so we are like the Roman culture today.
Marlin:
That's right. Let me take a break. The phone number for your questions
is 1-800-351-1212. The guest is Caryl Matrisciana. We'll be right back.
Marlin:
Alright we're back, 1-800-351-1212. Let's take some calls. Cheryl is
in Maine. Hi Cheryl.
Cheryl:
Hi, how are you?
Marlin:
Very well, how are you?
.
Cheryl:
Good. What I wanted to say to Caryl was that I was involved in the occult
for 25 years and the influence today is insidious. It is very apropos
to the ends times and seducing spirits. But, I didn't get out of bondage
until I met someone that showed me how to get the baptism of the Holy
Spirit. I find that a lot of churches are dead to this. Unless someone
feels the regenerative power of the Holy Spirit of Christ, then the
Bible is dead and Christ is dead, and Satan's vortex of energy is very
much alive and people are flocking. They need something to make them
feel alive. Now Satan wants Christ's life to feel dead, and right now
he is winning, as far as I'm concerned, in a lot of ways. But my question
is, is Caryl going to the churches with this? Is she bringing it to
the forefront in the minds of the church, where they need to offer more
on the regenerative powers of the Holy Spirit versus the seducing spirits
of Satan, so people can know the difference and feel the power in the
difference of those spirits?
Marlin:
Good question, thanks Cheryl.
Caryl:
Cheryl, I hope that is what we are doing. That is why my husband and
I make the videos that we make. We rely very, very heavily on people
like yourself. By the way, I commend you on your powerful words, they
are very important words. It is only the Holy Spirit that is going to
be able to battle the spirits of this present age of darkness. My husband
and I believe that we make weapons for spiritual warfare. That is what
our videos are, and we need to put them into the hands of soldiers,
foot soldiers like yourself, and all others. Yes, we do market this
to the church and people like Marlin Maddoux who get this out on the
radio. We need all of you to be able to go into your community with
the video, to your teachers, to your schools, to your corporations,
and slowly talk one-on-one to people, then people like you to be able
to tell them about the power of the Holy Spirit and a new life in Christ.
Penna:
I might add, that is why Marlin chooses the materials that he does choose
to offer here on Point of View because we do believe they are tools.
We believe that people that are listening will be able to then spread
whatever knowledge that is to those in their sphere of influence. Let's
go back to the phones and talk to Dave in the state of California. Hi
Dave.
Dave:
Hi, I just wanted to kind of weigh into the conversation a little bit.
I have kind of a problem with some of this, in that Christianity is
only clearly superior, I think, because it says it is. Only 30 percent
of the people on the planet are Christian, and Christianity touts to
dismiss the others out of hand simply because of this pride that it
is superior. I think that puts Christianity on a lesser footing, at
least politically, because too often I think Christianity looks down
its nose on other people simply because it is decided that it is better.
Caryl:
Well Dave, yes there is a very small percentage of Christians in the
world, and a very small percentage of man will turn to the Bible and
accept what God has to say. There was a very small group of people called
Jews who God chose to be His remnant of people to change the world through
Jesus Christ. This isn't a popular message. The gospel of God certainly
isn't popular. It is much more popular to feel that human beings are
in control and able to manipulate their own circumstances through yoga
or human potential or whatever it is that they want to believe in. So,
you're right in a sense.
Dave:
It just seems a lot of the time that people open their Bibles and decide
that this is it.
Penna:
They read their Bible and believe their Bible.
Caryl:
The Bible isn't man written, in a sense.
It has been inspired by the words of God. It is God speaking to man
through his Holy Spirit. So, one has got to first of all go to the intimacy
of the author of the Bible and see him as a person that created you,
Dave, and loves you and cares for you and wants you to go along the
right path.
Marlin:
Thank you Dave. You know, let's face it, we are in the age, the age
of tolerance, the age of non-judgmentalism Now let's take this a little
bit further. We are still in the aftershock of September 11th, 2001,
when the terrorists struck the World Trade Center, The Pentagon, and
so on, and all across America on the campuses particularly, there were
students who simply could not look and say that the terrorists that
drove the airplanes into the towers were wrong. That we have to look
back at their life circumstances and find out what made them do what
they did. There was a girl named Allison Hornstein that wrote an article
in I think the Wall Street Journal, or one of those, The Washington
Post, Time, something. But, said that "On our campus we considered
both sides of it, and we looked at it, and we were not able to say that
the actions of the terrorists, in fact, were wrong." Also one of
the big things in the colleges today is that American system of government
and society cannot say that it is better than any other. Penna you know,
being in the textbook battle for years, one of the things that has been
fought in the textbooks is to expunge anything in the textbook that
even hints that America might be superior in its values, in its system,
in its democracy, and so on, than any other country. Now, if you have
a generation that is raised up on that, and you come along and say that
Jesus Christ is the only savior, there is only one way to God, that
person is going to be just like the caller that said, "Who are
you to say that Christianity is better than anything?"
Penna:
We are really building a mindset that says that there are no absolutes
in society. There is nothing right, there is nothing wrong, there is
nothing good, there is nothing bad. Those words are going to lose their
relevance.
Marlin:
But you know something Caryl, talking about Eastern mysticism and so
on, in it the teaching of Karma, reincarnation, and so on. Somewhere
along the line you have to make up your mind which one is right. I mean,
let's face it, your eternal destination depends upon that. So, sooner
or later you have to make up your own mind. Let me go back to Gods of
the New Age, the video, and there is a cut here that I want you to hear.
(Playing video)
Marlin:
Wow. Ladies and gentleman at least you can give us credit for having
the courage for saying things that are absolutely not politically correct
today. There is only one Savior and that is Jesus Christ. It is not
Mahatma Ghandhi, it's not John Lennon, it is not Buddha, it's not anything
or anybody else, there is only one Savior and that is Jesus Christ.
That makes me narrow-minded and a bigot, and I wear that as a badge
of honor. Get a copy of the video, it is called Gods of the New Age.
The phone number to order it is 1-800-347-5151. Suggested gift of $24.95.
Ask for the video Gods of the New Age. We'll be back with your phone
calls right after this.
Marlin:
Welcome back ladies and gentleman. I have got the greatest job on the
face of the earth. I get to sit at a table and talk to some of the most
charming, beautiful, intelligent, and articulate people on the earth.
I am surrounded by beauty today. Yeah Ron, that includes you too. Penna
Dexter and Caryl Matrisciana. Caryl Matrisciana for years producing
films with Jeremiah Films. As I mentioned earlier, I don't know how
many years, 20 something years ago I started talking about The New Age
Movement with an attorney, a lady attorney by the name of Constance
Cumby. She wrote a book called Hidden Dangers of the Rainbow. I suppose
it was one of the first nationwide exposes and warnings of what the
New Age Movement was, because 20 something years later I still talk
to people and they say, Marlin I remember those interviews that you
had with Constance Cumby. Then sometime in the mid 80's I got hold of
a series of tapes that was put together by Caryl Matrisciana on the
Pagan Invasion. It filled in so many of the blanks about what the New
Age Movement is. As I said, I like to simplify things as much as I possibly
can, and looking at Caryl's material and looking at this video that
we are talking about today, you just simply have to go back and tie
it into the Hindu religion. You know if you go back to the book of Genesis
when the serpent, Satan, came to Eve, what was the thing that he was
waving in front of her? You shall be as gods.
Caryl:
And you won't die.
Marlin:
And you won't die. Two things, you shall be as gods and you won't die.
So, Hinduism, Caryl Matrisciana, basically offers the same thing.
Caryl:
Same thing. Reincarnation says that you will not die and that your body,
even though your body dies, your soul just continues and you come in
in a more advanced, or less advanced state. It is the most horrible
concept. To the Hindu, they believe this to be imprisonment. They are
trying to get out of reincarnation.
Marlin:
They don't like reincarnation.
Caryl:
They don't like it one bit, that is why they practice yoga, so that
they can become more enlightened in a higher state of consciousness,
so that they will not return the hundreds of lives that possibly they
will do. So they want to try and get out of this cycle of hopelessness,
of death and life, death and life, death and life.
Marlin:
What is nirvana?
Caryl:
Less consciousness. A state, a hypnotic state. In yoga, if you could
just keep on focusing inward, inwardly, and try and get that serpent
power, that inward flame, that flicker, that human potential, to come
higher and higher and higher to this third eye, this little space in
the middle of the forehead, you can then become enlightened to a concept
of your own god potential. Your own power to be able to overcome circumstances.
Marlin:
Now I have read, in fact I have interviewed, I can't remember who he
was, but he was a disciple of Sai Baba.
Caryl:
Sai Baba - Tal Brooke from Spiritual Counterfeit Project.
Marlin:
But he talks about the meditation to the point that they have these
out of body experiences. They see lights, you know, it's not just something
strictly in the imagination.
Caryl:
No it isn't. Well, of course, the confusion here is that what happens
is that once you get your body into neutral, then you're making it available
to powers and principalities to take you wherever they want to take
you, or to deceive you. The father of lies is the originator or the
deceiver, the liar, the one that confuses. So, whether they are real
experiences or not, you know, there is debate about that, but the fact
is that the devotee, the disciple truly believes that they are being
astrally projected. Here you have this concept of being taken out of
your body. Now, remember earlier on in the show I mentioned that everything
God does is counterfeited by Satan. We know in Biblical times when God
himself took certain people out of the body, as in Paul and John, to
let him see down for the book of Revelation, to be able to look into
the future. So this is when God takes an individual to a place that
will encourage the church, or encourage faith in God. Occultic manipulation,
sorcery, divination of the same experience is when you put your mind
in neutral, become self-hypnotized; allow powers and principalities
to come in to deceive you into delusion and what is happening. This
concept which used to be an adult dangerous teaching for adult disciples
in advanced stages of yoga, is now being taught to children in schools
in America through Harry Potter, who goes in astral projective phases,
who goes into astral projection, blanking out his mind to get into a
delusionary place….
Marlin:
To a generation that is being prepared.
Caryl:
An entire generation. When you think of little young Harry Potter who
has got the mark in the middle of his forehead…..
Marlin:
So he has one?
Caryl:
He has a mark. He was given a mark as a child.
Marlin:
I haven't read the books or seen the movie, so I don't know.
Caryl:
So here are hundreds and thousands of children putting that mark on
their head to show that they are in allegiance to their hero Harry Potter.
They are already being conditioned.
Penna:
Marlin you were going through the list of people who have helped Christians
over the years understand the New Age. One of those people was actually
in the video and we heard her speak. This was Johanna Michaelsen. I
know that her writing influenced me as I had read her book. I think
it is called Like Lambs to the Slaughter. I had small children at that
time and you could see how the atmosphere in the schools was being prepared
for these children to transform their minds. Nobody would admit that
you were trying to make little New Agers out of them. What you were
trying to do was make them behave, or make them do well in school.
Marlin:
That's all the teacher wants is to get the kids quiet.
Penna:
Right. So this is a technique that you use, but it goes so much deeper.
You end up, sometimes, hypnotizing these kids, opening them up to spirits
and to all kinds of psychological harm. That scared me. It really scared
me. I think when you think of something that is actually going to effect
you children and the children in the society, you start to worry about
it.
Marlin:
Let's take some calls. 1-800-351-1212. Pam has been holding on awhile.
Pam, thank you for holding on.
Pam:
No problem. Marlin, thank you so much too for what you do. As one in
the body of Jesus Christ I am so thankful that we have a way of finding
out what the truth is. I can't uphold you enough and say enough about
what you and Point of View does.
Marlin:
You're very kind. Thank you.
Pam:
Thank you. Caryl I have a question. So many of my questions have been
answered just while listening to you here. You had just spoken about
when Paul was taken away in the Spirit. I have read different books
by such as John G. Lake, Maria Woodworth-Etter, I believe her name was.
Where these people had been taken away in the Spirit, and in the Bible
it talks about in the end times, you know, that God will pour out His
Spirit upon all flesh.
Marlin:
Okay, I'm running a little short, give me a question real quick.
Pam:
Okay, the question that I have is where do you take it to as far as
one being in such deep meditation to the point of where you have such
an overwhelming feeling of the Spirit of God in pondering and thinking
about Him, what is the fine line?
Marlin:
You know, you said something about, and thank you Pam, the whole concept
of a Christian meditation is meditating on God, thinking of God. The
Hindu, New Age, is to empty your mind, like you said the room, and anybody
can come in.
Caryl:
And I think the difference here is that meditation, Biblical meditation,
is meditation on the Law of God, not on my own feeling and my experiences,
and that I may be taken to another place. I think we have got to focus
in on the Word, and the Word will be witnessed by the Bible itself.
I think any type of mystical meditation where you are in a feeling outside
of Biblical concepts is very dangerous.
Marlin:
I would agree.
Caryl:
I would stay very clear of that.
Marlin:
In South Carolina, Kevin you're on the air.
Kevin:
Alright, good afternoon. I wanted to call because, I listened to the
first few callers and they were basically saying there was no moral
absolutes, or there are no spiritual absolutes. One thing in hearing
them and just listening, because I do work in a position of leadership
in my church. In hearing them, they are not doing anything more but
validating what the Bible says. I just wanted to shed some light, if
I could really quickly, everybody…….
Marlin:
I'll tell you what, let me take a quick break and I'll come back to
you Kevin.
Kevin:
Oh great.
Marlin:
Okay? 1-800-351-1212 is the call-in line. Caryl Matrisciana with us
talking about the New Age Movement. 1-800-351-1212. We'll be back after
this.
Marlin:
Hey we're back. 1-800-351-1212. If you just joined us you have just
missed an hour and forty five minutes of some of the best radio programming
you will ever hear. Please don't do this again. Be here tomorrow 1:00
central, 2:00 East, 11:00 Pacific, don't miss it. 1-800-351-1212. Kevin
in South Carolina had a word of wisdom for us. Kevin, go right ahead.
Kevin:
Yes, I was saying that any of us, or any of them, or anyone who blurs
the lines of the spiritual absolute of the Bible, in just hearing some
of your caller, what they are doing is validating what the Bible says.
Because when we read the Bible we have always speculated, I believe
speculated as Christians about what the lukewarm is that is being spoken
about in the book of Revelation. What is those who are lukewarm who
will be spewed out of the mouth of God? I truly believe that us, as
Christians, who accept other religions as being equal to ours, though
we say that we ascribe to the Christian religion, then we think about
what is the apostasy. The apostasy, I believe, is here with what we
have been saying, and other ministers, and other programs have said
about the New Age Movement, is falling away, falling into those practices,
saying that all religions are on equal footing. The only thing that
I can think of when Miss Matrisciana was talking about the enlightenment
and the serpent, it so ties directly into what the Bible says about
Satan was Lucifer, the light bearer, that fell to the earth, who tried
to enlighten man, which is what he tried to do in the Garden of Eden
when he basically tricked Adam and Eve into taking the fruit of the
knowledge of good and evil. Because if they had not partaken that fruit
of the knowledge of good and evil, we would never have the knowledge
of good and evil because there was no evil, so there would have never
been good. We would have just been walking in the presence of God.
Marlin:
Alright Kevin, I think you did that very well. Thank you very much.
Caryl Matrisciana, you know, Kevin and some of the others were kind
of getting a glimpse of the way so many are going today, neutralized
for so many years in the public schools, multiculturalism, tolerance
of all things, no belief is better, no country is better. I go back,
you know, right after September 11th, Franklin Graham, and we had him
on the program right after that, but Franklin Graham had the audacity
to say that while he respected other religions, as a Christian he could
recognize only one God and Savior, Jesus Christ. Basically saying that
the simple message that Jesus Christ is the Savior of the World; he
can't accept Mohammad, Allah, or any other God. The media and everybody
tore him apart because he was politically incorrect, he was judgmental,
and so on. But I admired him for it.
Caryl:
Well the Bible says that there is going to be in a very short time a
one-world leader who is going to come down and rule the earth for a
thousand years. That is going to be Jesus Christ himself. Then all of
these people that wonder who is Jesus and what are His values can deal
with that. But, the issue at the moment is why would somebody not take
the risk of believing that the Bible is the Word of God, that God is
truth Himself, that God is love? Why not take that risk and accept that
for the few remaining years, and then be able to stand at the feet of
somebody that is truth and love, and ask Him the question? Rather than
say at the moment, I don't believe in all of this, I am not going to
take this in, then for a million years, for eternity, be an outcast,
be a spiritual outcast.
Penna:
You know, we talk about what is going to happen in the future. We also
know that there is going to be a world leader, and that there is going
to be a world religion. I see this New Age Movement and this whole trend
toward not being able to say my religion is right and your religion
is wrong, leading toward us, as a world, being able to accept that world
leader and that world religion. Because we really aren't going to be
grounded in our faith, no matter what religion it is.
Caryl:
Well there was an example two thousand years ago when the religious
leaders of their time didn't know about Jesus Christ appearing as the
Son of God. They didn't know they were misled, because they were expecting
Jesus to come as the political head of the environment for a thousand
years. They were misled and didn't know. The same thing is going to
happen today, that people are going to be misled by, as you mentioned,
a religious political leader that is going to come down and say he is
the Christ and lead for a thousand years. But he is not going to have
in his hands the wounds, the nails of the cross. He won't be able to
be decided on and he will deceive millions. So I think with the New
Age and with Kevin letting us know that there is an apostasy going on,
there is a falling away, there is, all of this is part of the concept,
the new training for the global citizen. I think people don't understand
that the children today have to be moved away from their familiar traditional
values in order to be able to get into this new global paradigm that
will prepare them for the ultimate deception. We as Christian parents
have got an opportunity to lead our children. We need to keep the church
and people aware of traditional Biblical principals.
Marlin:
Connie is in Pennsylvania. Hi Connie.
Connie:
Hi. God bless you. Thanks for taking my call. I say amen to everything
you guys are talking about today. You, Caryl, God bless you and your
husband for coming out with this video, but I said, "Lord, I don't
think we'll every see her on the Oprah Show." I hope so. I have
a fantastic book we'll call "Oprah the Evangelist." You know,
she is promoting everything we're talking about today.
Marlin:
That's right, she is promoting this whole New Age…..
Caryl:
That's why she is so popular.
Marlin:
Yep.
Caryl:
Right?
Marlin:
That's right. Are you booked for the Oprah Show anytime soon Caryl?
Caryl:
I'm not popular.
Connie:
My whole family are New Agers, they are religious, they're Catholic.
The comment I want to make is that I hope you guys are aware, I'm sure
you are, that the Pope is also embracing a lot of Eastern religion.
I have friends who are Catholic, and they think it is okay to go into
the mosques.
Marlin:
You know, I have, in study of this, I not only know, I'm not sure if
I know personally Catholic priests that are in the New Age Movement,
but I know of Catholic priests, a large number of Catholic nuns. But
by the same token I know Methodists and Presbyterians, and Lutherans,
and all of them that are into the New Age Movement, that hold these
type of meetings in the church, the yoga, the meditation, and the whole
thing.
Caryl:
Well, look at the concept of God being made male and female. Look at
the whole movement, the feminine movement in the church, that femaleness
is part of God's concept, we'd then say "Our father/mother who
art in heaven and earth."
Marlin:
Okay thanks Connie.
Connie:
Okay, God bless you.
Marlin:
Okay, bye. Caryl, got about a minute and a half left here. You have
gotten a lot of good feedback from this video, it has really been effective.
Caryl:
It has been so effective, and I would encourage your listeners to take
Gods of the New Age video and to use it as a tool. To put it into the
hands of New Agers or Wiccans that they know, or people in their family
who are unclear about the moral relativism that we live in today. It
is a very, very powerful video with footage from all over the world.
We have interviewed heads of the United Nations telling us what the
United Nations' goal is about the global indoctrination of the global
village child or person, if you will. What they want the world to become.
It is a very, very powerful and exciting video.
Marlin:
It's a little scary, isn't it Penna?
Penna:
It is scary. I think that every Christian should really watch this video,
because this is permeating our society. It is influencing the direction
that we are going. We need to understand it, and a picture is worth
a thousand words, so you really get it in the video.
Marlin:
The title of the video is Gods of the New Age. Rabi Maharaj who wrote
the book The Death of a Guru. I think we've had him on.
Penna:
We may have.
Marlin:
I think we have. He said that it is the most powerful Christian documentary
he has ever seen. Hal Lindsey says that he believes that this is the
most important Christian film of the decade. Those are strong endorsements.
Get a copy of it by calling 1-800-347-5151, or write to me and enclose
a gift of $24.95 and ask for the video Gods of the New Age. Once again,
the phone number to order is 1-800-347-5151. Thanks for listening and
thanks to all of the callers. We'll see you tomorrow. So long everybody.
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Gods
of the New Age: Point Of View with Marlin Maddoux